political maybe

Date: Wed Nov 1 11:39 AM, 2006

RE: political maybe

Date: Wed Nov 1 12:03 PM, 2006

I have been involved with allstars for 9 years and it takes alot to wow me as I have seen so much. I can pick out bad transitions and sloppiness like I can spot my hubby in a crowd. There are little things called details that many smaller gyms just don't focus on. The most common problems I see in routines from small gyms are their transitions and the flow of the routine! chop chop chop.Everyone's got tumbling, stunts, jumps. Not everyone has a cohesive routine. Unless the owner/coach is truly adept at this (and doesn't just think they are), a small gym will benefit greatly hiring an outside choreographer!

Date: Wed Nov 1 12:09 PM, 2006

I have to admit, when I saw Morton on the judging panel at one of our competitions, my heart lept. My first thought was, "oh thank goodness, a fair person on the panel." And we are from another gym.....

I don't know ANY judges. And when I saw his face, after hearing all the negative comments, I was very happy. But then I thought about it and how can I make any sort of judgement when I don't even KNOW the other people? Why would they want to hurt my kid just cause she's from another gym? I really don't think they would and if we don't place well, I guess we have some work to do!!!!

Date: Wed Nov 1 1:13 PM, 2006

I think we saw cases where the small gyms did indeed beat out the large on Sunday. Large had their simple sharp routines and were beat out by more difficulty in the not so sharp but not so simple routines. It was a nice mixture of both styles represented. I would not ever assume sharp and clean but simple will win over creative, difficult, but sloppy; it all depends on the judges and the competitions. If you assume you're gonna win because it was clean, you're probably one of the ones that have posted on this board how shocked they are that their team didn't win. I would hope gyms shoot for the entire package... simple routines adding difficulty along the way, sloppy routines working hard to clean them up.

Good luck to everyone, it should be a fun season with lots of very talented teams to go against.

Date: Wed Nov 1 1:24 PM, 2006

NOBODY on ROYALS works for JAMZ. THIS IS FACT. JUST CALL ROYALS OR JAMZ.

Date: Wed Nov 1 1:55 PM, 2006

Pyramids mom wrote:

I have to chime in on this as I came from a "small gym" to Pyramids. The small gym we were at did nothing but complain at every competition that the "large gyms" always win just by showing up. Now this is the owner/director saying this and trying to get all the girls and parents to feel the same way. After two seasons with this gym I had had enough. Enough of the negativity, and enough of going to comp after comp and not doing well. The only comps we did well at were the ones that none of the "big gyms" went to.

We came to Pyramids a few years ago and the difference I see is that my daughter works harder at practice than she EVER did before and the routines are much more professional, and that shows at competition. You can stick all of your stunts and tumbling, but if your girls are running around the floor and running into each other to get to their next spot, it makes the routine look messy and the girls usually have a look on their face like they are panicked to do the next thing and not having fun. This stuff counts on the score sheet, more than you think! We pay a lot more to be at this gym, but it is worth it. The coaching is better and they are very experienced in putting together good routines with great coreography (sp) and you don't see girls running from one end of the floor to the other like chickens with their heads cut off. That is why we do well, not because we have some in with the judges.

You have to look at the entire presentation of a routine, not just if they hit their stunts and didn't touch down on their tumbling. It is the whole package. I know I didn't "see it" as much when we were at the other gym, but it is there if you look for it. I can tell at competitions now if we stick our "clean and simple" routine (as some people call it) and our competitors have a little more difficulty in their routine but are constantly running around and look rushed or scattered in their routine, we are usually going to place better.

Small gyms can win just as easily as large gyms if they are willing to do what it takes and what it takes is experienced coaches and coreographers (sp) teaching your kids. Cheer Divas has the right idea. They are a really good smaller gym that has struggled to beat the larger gyms they compete against. This year they hired a well known coreographer (sp) to do their routine and everyone is talking about how great their teams are going to be and I agree! It makes a difference!

Good luck to all the teams out there, do your best and have fun doing it and the trophies will come!

That's great it worked out for you, but people learn from their mistakes. I think pyramids does a GREAT job, but don't discredit other teams because it didn't work out for you. Some gyms go through bad years. I remember when pyramids was a small gym and didn't have much going on. They had to go through alot of bad years to get where they are.

Date: Wed Nov 1 3:07 PM, 2006

Pyramids mom, I think it's great you found a place you're happy with, you have every right to be proud of your gym. But it's a little arrogant to put down small gyms that don't have the same style as yours, with patronizing remarks like you too can win a trophy if you work real hard. As was said in another post, your large gym may not fair so well at a competition such as American Championship whose scoring is a bit different than what you may be used to. And large doesn't necessarily mean better for everyone. Better for you perhaps, but not for all.

Date: Wed Nov 1 4:01 PM, 2006

Well, I knew people would probably interpret what I was saying differently and for that I apologize. I do not want to put down small gyms. That was not my intent. I was just trying to say what I have observed from both experiences. More to the fact is that I realized that it is more about the whole package put on the floor that determines who wins and who doesn't. Not if you hit your stunts better than they did or yours were harder than their's. Yes those things matter, but it is not always the determining factor like some seem to think.

There are a lot of different styles of cheerleading out there because everyone has different opinions on what they like and don't like. That is why it is great that we all have choices about where we cheer at and what comps we go to. I prefer clean and solid routines that progress in difficulty as the season goes on so I am somewhere that does that. Others prefer to try to go all out right from the start and clean it up as they go which is ok too. But I think when you talk about judging, it is a matter of what they prefer on that day and there are judges that prefer one over another and that is what is going to win on that day more than a contest of who knows who in the judging booth.

Look at Jamz this past weekend, our teams were all over the map. The ones that won were clean and solid, the ones that didn't were not. We beat some big and small gyms, and lost to them too. Some of our clean and solid routines were beat out by some that were more difficult with minimal mistakes. I personally thought the judging was pretty fair. And although I am not a big fan of Jamz for other reasons, I thought is was a good comp overall to start the season. Again I will wish EVERYONE big and small the best of luck this season and look forward to a great year!

Date: Wed Nov 1 4:17 PM, 2006

As a parent from a very large gym, we do get the remarks about how we won cause we have a large gym. We have our advantages and disadvantages like every other gym. But we do have on thing in common. Teams are competing against teams. Not gyms against gyms. I think the advantage we have is that we have a larger staff and more ideas. But our disadvantages are that sometimes we are too big and we don't get to know everyone (parent wise). But we try to fight that with lots of get-togethers.

We did go to a smaller gym once but didn't like it. It was run too much like a (oh dang it, whats that word) but the larger gym is more like a democracy. But seriously, that doesn't mean EVERY gym is run like that!!! Different gyms are so different. Just like you and I are different. When you find one that fits your family and style, you are very lucky. Some never do. But don't give up. There is a team out there for everyone!!! What bewilders me is, why people stay somewhere where they are unhappy. Then they complain about everything they can. Why spend so much money when you aren't happy? I don't get that.

Best of luck!!!

Date: Thu Nov 2 12:21 AM, 2006

RUMOR ONLY wrote:

NOBODY on ROYALS works for JAMZ. THIS IS FACT. JUST CALL ROYALS OR JAMZ.

Ok, So I was only 1/2 right....Corina Clark is only a Co-Owner for the Royal All Stars. BUT she is JAMZ head instructor for cheer & dance and is a professional judge. That is what her Bio says and that is how she signed her name on the mess board, under Jamz thread, page 6, bottom.

now that is a fact !! :)

Date: Thu Nov 2 9:25 AM, 2006

You are incorrect. Corina was a full time JAMZ staff member and really enjoyed working for JAMZ. However she is now professional dancer and cheerleader and this does not allow her the time to work for JAMZ. She misses JAMZ dearly and they miss her. She will always be a JAMZ staff member in heart however she is no longer on their staff due to her other committments.

Date: Thu Nov 2 9:30 AM, 2006

Wrong!!! wrote:

RUMOR ONLY wrote:

NOBODY on ROYALS works for JAMZ. THIS IS FACT. JUST CALL ROYALS OR JAMZ.

Ok, So I was only 1/2 right....Corina Clark is only a Co-Owner for the Royal All Stars. BUT she is JAMZ head instructor for cheer & dance and is a professional judge. That is what her Bio says and that is how she signed her name on the mess board, under Jamz thread, page 6, bottom.

now that is a fact !! :)

CORINA DID NOT WORK AT THIS COMPETITION OR JUDGE. SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT DO YOU THINK JAMZ FAVORED ROYALS BECAUSE OF THEIR PREVIOUS AFILLIATIONS? IF YOU YOU ARE MISTAKEN. JAMZ IS THE BEST ORGANIZATION OUT THEIR. THEY CARE ABOUT ALL THE KIDS. THE REASON THEIR STAFF MEMBERS ARE INVOLVED IN SO MANY PROGRAMS IS BECAUSE THEY ALL LOVE KIDS AND THIS IS KEY WHEN WORKING WITH JAMZ IT IS ABOUT HAVING FUN AND JAMZ EXCEEDS OUR EXPECTATIONS ALL THE WAY AROUND WHEN IT COMES TO THE KIDS. THEY ARE AMAZING AND THIS IS WHY THEY ARE GROWING TO LARGE AND SO SUCCESSFULL.

Date: Thu Nov 2 9:35 AM, 2006

YOU ARE STILL WRONG wrote:

Wrong!!! wrote:

RUMOR ONLY wrote:

NOBODY on ROYALS works for JAMZ. THIS IS FACT. JUST CALL ROYALS OR JAMZ.

Ok, So I was only 1/2 right....Corina Clark is only a Co-Owner for the Royal All Stars. BUT she is JAMZ head instructor for cheer & dance and is a professional judge. That is what her Bio says and that is how she signed her name on the mess board, under Jamz thread, page 6, bottom.

now that is a fact !! :)

CORINA DID NOT WORK AT THIS COMPETITION OR JUDGE. SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT DO YOU THINK JAMZ FAVORED ROYALS BECAUSE OF THEIR PREVIOUS AFILLIATIONS? IF YOU YOU ARE MISTAKEN. JAMZ IS THE BEST ORGANIZATION OUT THEIR. THEY CARE ABOUT ALL THE KIDS. THE REASON THEIR STAFF MEMBERS ARE INVOLVED IN SO MANY PROGRAMS IS BECAUSE THEY ALL LOVE KIDS AND THIS IS KEY WHEN WORKING WITH JAMZ IT IS ABOUT HAVING FUN AND JAMZ EXCEEDS OUR EXPECTATIONS ALL THE WAY AROUND WHEN IT COMES TO THE KIDS. THEY ARE AMAZING AND THIS IS WHY THEY ARE GROWING TO LARGE AND SO SUCCESSFULL.

I agree. When our staff (Morton) Judges we are even more worried. Our coaches would judge us harder than anyone. I think this is true for all coaches that work for competition companies. They are more critical of their own teams because they know their potential. I dont think this would even be unfair. It happens all the time with every competition. Fair is fair the score sheets are very objective. Either you met the requirements or not. Plus their are always more than one judge

Date: Thu Nov 2 10:08 AM, 2006

YOU ARE STILL WRONG wrote:

Wrong!!! wrote:

RUMOR ONLY wrote:

NOBODY on ROYALS works for JAMZ. THIS IS FACT. JUST CALL ROYALS OR JAMZ.

Ok, So I was only 1/2 right....Corina Clark is only a Co-Owner for the Royal All Stars. BUT she is JAMZ head instructor for cheer & dance and is a professional judge. That is what her Bio says and that is how she signed her name on the mess board, under Jamz thread, page 6, bottom.

now that is a fact !! :)

CORINA DID NOT WORK AT THIS COMPETITION OR JUDGE. SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT DO YOU THINK JAMZ FAVORED ROYALS BECAUSE OF THEIR PREVIOUS AFILLIATIONS? IF YOU YOU ARE MISTAKEN. JAMZ IS THE BEST ORGANIZATION OUT THEIR. THEY CARE ABOUT ALL THE KIDS. THE REASON THEIR STAFF MEMBERS ARE INVOLVED IN SO MANY PROGRAMS IS BECAUSE THEY ALL LOVE KIDS AND THIS IS KEY WHEN WORKING WITH JAMZ IT IS ABOUT HAVING FUN AND JAMZ EXCEEDS OUR EXPECTATIONS ALL THE WAY AROUND WHEN IT COMES TO THE KIDS. THEY ARE AMAZING AND THIS IS WHY THEY ARE GROWING TO LARGE AND SO SUCCESSFULL.

Then maybe she should take it off her Bio.... or add "is a former Jamz..." and all I was trying to add was a example. Nor, did I say she worked at this comp or was a judge.

Date: Thu Nov 2 10:28 AM, 2006

If you were there watching, any awards Royals received were justified; I thought they did great. I rarely see any favoritism in Jamz judging, which I think is why they continue to have a decent turnout year after year (especially compared to other regional comps).

Date: Thu Nov 2 10:58 AM, 2006

This is so funny. No wonder this is an anonymous forum. You really seem like someone who has concerns with ROYALS. They are a great program. I did not know people like yourself spent so much time researching things like this. Who are you and where are you from? if is okay to ask? I wonder why you are so concened with ROYALS and JAMZ. They earned their award. To say JAMZ is bias is just too much. JAMZ is great and we love going to JAMZ. ROYALS has won many competitions before this one so why is the concern now. Who do you think should have one? and Why?

Date: Thu Nov 2 11:19 AM, 2006

The Royals Cheer and Dance program was good this past weekend. They actually stuck out to me, more than any other program there. They had alot of stunting and tumbling going on. Cheerleading has DIFFERENT styles and there all going to have that same Nor Cal look. Seamless transitions are great and dances to old songs are too,but when it comes down to it, u need the skills. The results are justified.

Date: Thu Nov 2 12:07 PM, 2006

I think we are done with this topic !!

Date: Thu Nov 2 12:10 PM, 2006

We need to focus on congrats not causing problems. We all love our gyms and our kids. LETS chat about some neat stuff...

Date: Thu Nov 2 1:16 PM, 2006

Speaking of Jamz, the pictures are up. It looks like you can order them digitally, which is nice because you can get more copies that way. I just tried to order 5, and it ended up being $9.95 apiece that way (which seems high, but not if I can make multiple copies, or email them to friends/family).