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Post Info TOPIC: Level 4 or 5 How to choose?
Nor Cal Owner

Date:
Level 4 or 5 How to choose?


So I am going to start this topic and please as you always do leave your opinions but don't bash me for mine.

Statement: Many Nor Cal teams have the potential to compete Level 5 Locally but do not yet have the talent to hang with the big dogs as one would put it. So do you say to the 5 or 6 kids that have fulls and doubles that they are going to compete level 4 all year or do you think it is better to compete level 5 locally and compete level 4 Nationally and when I say Nationally I mean Cheersport, UCA and NCA.

Many people call it sandbagging but I call it being realistic. What does everyone else think. Let the carnage begin.

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Always

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Always compete with what the MAJORITY of what your team has. You wanna win??? Have MORE THAN 80% of your team doing the highest level of tumbling and stunting allowed. Otherwish, just stay in your own area and not travel, cause unfortunately, you will be beaten.

Just the way of the beast.....

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Understood

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I totally understand what you are saying and agree but what I think the poster is saying is what if you know you can go Level 5 locally and Level 4 Nationally. How do people feel about that?

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More Thoughts

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When you say you can go level 5 locally, do you mean you're not going against tough competition? Because locally here in Nor Cal there is tough competition at level 5, teams that have their eyes set on trying for a Worlds bid. I guess what I'm saying is, how do you know that you can go level 5 locally when you don't know who you're going against, and you don't know what other level 5 teams have to offer this season. Maybe you mean after a few wins locally at level 5, do you continue at that level when it's time for Nationals? If you've never won at level 5 locally, then there would be no point in staying at that level for Nationals. But if you've been winning, then I think it's a tough call. No guts no glory. It's easy to drop down a level just to win against teams that have stuck to their level the entire season. You don't see it in other sports, why would it be okay in this one?

Just curious, Cheersport and NCA I understand being mentioned; haven't heard many talk about UCA Nationals, is that one at the same caliber as the other two?



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Observer

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Why go to Nationals competitions where you have to drop down? The reason you go to Cheersport or NCA Nationals is to see how you stack up against those supposedly higher skilled teams. If your goal is to win or place in the top 3, then go to a smaller, more local Nationals competetion and see how you stack up against teams you have been competing against all season.

If you aren't ready for Cheersport or NCA at the level you are competing all season long, don't go!

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Get Real

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For whoever said competing level 5 locally is similar to traveling needs to get their eyes checked. Yes Power and cheergyms.com went to worlds, but lets get real. Teams like stingrays max out the level for each team. If its novice, then the whole team is doing squad double standing backhandsprings. I can't think of one novice team out here doing that. Same with Georgia, Top Gun, World Cup, Spirit of Texas, and Pro Spirit. Our teams haven't gotten tremendously better but by no means our events are at the same caliber as those in atlanta, dallas, or florida.

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How about this....

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Do you guys want to win or prove a point?

Last time I checked, we were in all star cheerleading to win. So if moving down a level means you will win, well too bad sister. At least we would go home with the trophy and jacket!!!!!! Who cares if you don't like it!

Morally correct? Nope. But then again, when has ANY cheer gym accused of being morally correct??? And we ALL know it's easier to compete level 5 in California. Love the teams who went to Worlds, but they can't hang on the east coast. One day yes maybe, but this year? Yea............ok. So how is it on YOUR planet? (laughing)

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What?

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Excuse me but I recall a few of the California teams that went to Worlds and not only hung with the east coast but beat several of the teams from the east coast and from the South. Call me crazy but if 3rd, 4th and 5th places weren't hanging with the best of the best then what is? Did you see how many teams were in those divisions? What, do you think they were all California teams? NO. Don't get on here and try to belittle what the best California teams did because what they did was amazing. Did they win? No. How many "East Coast" teams won? One, Gymtyme. Did they make California proud? YES, they did and are to be congratulated for making top 5 in the World! Did you?

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How About This

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I knew my post would ruffle feathers, but tough.

congrats to the teams for placing top 15. but we all know what the post was really about. and it wasn't for congratulating anyone. it was for stating facts. but there's always some who will come here and twist things. that's allright. it's to be expected.

now back to the topic.

move your teams down if you can't win in level 5. who cares. of course everyone in your division will be mad but if they can't beat you at their OWN level, then maybe they shouldn't be there!

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Observer

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How about this.... wrote:

Do you guys want to win or prove a point?

Last time I checked, we were in all star cheerleading to win. So if moving down a level means you will win, well too bad sister. At least we would go home with the trophy and jacket!!!!!! Who cares if you don't like it!

Morally correct? Nope. But then again, when has ANY cheer gym accused of being morally correct??? And we ALL know it's easier to compete level 5 in California. Love the teams who went to Worlds, but they can't hang on the east coast. One day yes maybe, but this year? Yea............ok. So how is it on YOUR planet? (laughing)


"Nor Cal Owner" will first have to determine what the objective is for traveling and spending big money to attend NCA or Cheersport.

1. Is it to give their kids the experience and understanding of what it really takes to compete against other teams around the country at level 5 and to see how they would place. This is a great opportunity and has motivated many kids and teams to work harder next year.
2. Is it to have a better chance at winning at level 4 and bragging about NCA or Cheersport National title. And don't think just because you are a level 5 team dropping down to level 4 that you will win. How motivated will those level 5 kids be when they say, yes we won, but not at the level we competed all season long. Soiunds like an hollow win to me.

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Hey how about this

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You are the person who put out there that teams from California couldn't hang with teams from the east coast, then you talk about what the post was really about? However, since YOU put it out there then you will just have to reap what you sowed. "What" set you straight! You couldn't hang so you through in the 15th place team. And you point was? Tell me, who was 16th, 17th, 18th, 19th, 20th, 21st, 22nd, 23rd, and 24th? You? LOL!!!!

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How About This

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And how do you know how my team placed? You are ASSUMING that I am from California. You are ASSUMING that my team went to Worlds. And you are ASSUMING that my team didn't even place or even win.

Here's your lesson for the day...

Never Assume.... it makes an AS* out of U and ME

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Hey how about this

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None of the teams I listed above were from CALIFORNIA. They were all from the east or south! So much for your thinking that I was assuming. I KNOW that your're not from California. So why don't you and your level 4, oops level 5 team take your jacket and run.

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pssssst

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very quite whisper

"you're assumtions are showing"

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The Problem

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The problem is that teams are put in the wrong divisions to begin with. So fans, coaches, or other cheerleaders assume those teams should be in level 5 all year. To me is, if you don't go to their gym, their practices, or pay their fees, then don't run your mouth. Again teams might think their team is level 5 and realize they shouldn't of competed in that level. Why is it such big deal. Its like competing level 5 in Nor Cal all year and going to Dallas in level 4 which is a smart decision. Why are you criticized for that. I wouldn't want to compete against Spirit of Texas small coed if the skills weren't there to BEGIN with.

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True, but

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I see what you're saying, but in any other sport, it's called cheating. It's taking your major teams and playing in minors for the championships. It's like taking your varsity players and putting them on JV for the playoffs. Sure, you'll get away with it, but does that make it right??

You SHOULD know if you're in the wrong level by the third or even 4th competition. If you don't, then you're not choosing the right competitions (you're not choosing the ones that challenge you to do your best). It's not fair to the teams that stay true to their level all year long when level 5 teams decide to drop down to 4 after competing all year at 5 (same goes for other levels).

Nobody is saying a team that has level 5 talent should not be competing at level 4. But to drop down at the VERY END of your season just for the win just doesn't seem right.

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I agree

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True, but wrote:

I see what you're saying, but in any other sport, it's called cheating. It's taking your major teams and playing in minors for the championships. It's like taking your varsity players and putting them on JV for the playoffs. Sure, you'll get away with it, but does that make it right??

You SHOULD know if you're in the wrong level by the third or even 4th competition. If you don't, then you're not choosing the right competitions (you're not choosing the ones that challenge you to do your best). It's not fair to the teams that stay true to their level all year long when level 5 teams decide to drop down to 4 after competing all year at 5 (same goes for other levels).

Nobody is saying a team that has level 5 talent should not be competing at level 4. But to drop down at the VERY END of your season just for the win just doesn't seem right.


Exactly.



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So..

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So what your saying is compete level 5 all year, and not place well. You finally want to end of a good note, BUT you either can place MUCH higher at your final nationals or just compete at level 5 just to say you did. Keep in mind, you get nothing out of competing at that level but self gratification and sometimes not even that. Parents and kids keep track of how they place, not at what level they compete. yes those extreme parents and cheereladers are like hawks who like competing at the highest level, but MOST kids just want to place well and have fun. I think you have to do whats best for the program.

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I think

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I think levels should be levels, and that they should do it like gymnastics, where you have to get a certain qualifying score to move up to the next level.

Athlete credentialing has the potential to solve this problem...IF they do it right.

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To So

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To "So", I think you missed the part where the post said you SHOULD KNOW if you're competing at the wrong level early in the competition season. If you're not placing well, guess what ... you're probably in the wrong level??

Make your change then, not at the very end just to make the claim that you won at Nationals. Other gyms and members typically know who has dropped down for the win anyway, so you're not really fooling anyone.

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