Senior Open 5

AirborneOwner · GURU

Senior Open 5

1anddone · Newbie

Love Love Love this division!!! i think it is a great transition into a regular level 5.. it is hard for a team to go from level 4 (layouts) to level 5 (double fulls) in senior open 5 you are not aloud to do double so it is a great transition!

YouDownwitCGC · Veteran Member

i agree great idea.. this is still only to 18 correct?

AirborneOwner · GURU

YouDownwitCGC wrote:

i agree great idea.. this is still only to 18 correct?

Correct it is 18 and under up to 36 with up to 4 guys!

CaliCheerWatcher · GURU

I think its a great idea. I hope to see some gyms have these teams next season. smile

flipkidjudge · Senior Member

As critical as I have been of USASF/Varsity, this is one thing I feel they have gotten right. It actually allows a gym to properly train their level 5's and compete their true skill level within level 5 instead of throwing them in with programs that primarily focus on level 5/Worlds type competitions. If they keep this from being a World's division, it will be a perfect training ground for everybody regardless of the size of your individual program. It will allow smaller/newer programs to actually build their Level 5's in all areas and give them competition where they won't be obliterated by Day 2, Top 5 World's teams. Fulls can be mastered instead of rushing them in order to progress to the next skill or else you won't max out the score sheet in tumbling. When they are ready to step up, they can. Also by keeping it from being a World's division, minimizes to some degree of really strong programs of intentionally dropping a team into this division to get a bid to World's.

Now if we can get Athlete ID cards, a way to check through these cards to eliminate programs using athletes that should not be competing, close existing loopholes that allow some foolishness to continue, have a true certification program for coaches, a Universal Score sheet for World's Bid Competitions...I might even wear an USASF shirt....once...rofl!!!!!

magicgirl · Member

Wait, what is senior open 5? Worlds Division....

CHERZ2U · Member

I love this idea biggrin

Can there be cross overs from world teams?

tracy · Veteran Member

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

RiptideAllStars · Veteran Member

tracy wrote:

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

Why should it be limited to all girls? I don't see the problem with letting guys on... It actually is perfect for our gym, who has been strong in Sr Coed 4 for a long time, we're actually thinking of making the jump to level 5 through this division first... We have MORE than 4 guys though, so we'd only take the ones who have fulls and are strong stunters...

CaliCheerWatcher · GURU

tracy wrote:

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

Woah! thats asking a little much, dont you think? I also dont see the problem with biger gyms using it. Big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills but just not quite ready to be on that super competitive level 5 team yet also, not just small gyms. This could be a great place for them. I could see in bigger gyms dropped there current teams into this division that could be a problem, but if its just an addition for those that would have otherwhise stayed on level 4 another year but have fulls. This could be a good think.

RiptideAllStars · Veteran Member

The more I think about it, it's actually perfect for our gym. We don't have to worry about competing with the major L5 teams - we can put on kids who are super close to L5 tumbling skills at the beginning of the season, and get our feet wet in the L5 arena competing against teams who are of like skill... and even if they are big level 5 crossovers, they won't be able to throw their doubles, so it'll level the playing field... I LIKE IT!!!

xpressjag · Senior Member

tracy wrote:

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

I agree that Senior Open needs to split up the coed and all girl. Not sure who's idea it was to combine all girl and coed, but it is not fair on both sides.

The spirit of Senior Open was based upon small gyms, but larger gyms developed open teams and took that option away from small gyms.

I like this division, but would like to see only round off back handspring fulls allowed. No combos into fulls or doubles.

I can gurantee that this division will be hit hard by large gyms and won't open up the doors to those small upcoming programs who want to break into the level 5 arena.

tracy · Veteran Member

CaliCheerWatcher wrote:

tracy wrote:

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

Woah! thats asking a little much, dont you think? I also dont see the problem with biger gyms using it. Big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills but just not quite ready to be on that super competitive level 5 team yet also, not just small gyms. This could be a great place for them. I could see in bigger gyms dropped there current teams into this division that could be a problem, but if its just an addition for those that would have otherwhise stayed on level 4 another year but have fulls. This could be a good think.

I personally believe that my request is not too much to ask. This is the only way that a small gym could have a fighting chance in the BIG, BAD, CHEER WORLD!

It's time to start looking at the bigger picture here and there needs to be restrictions on certain categories and held to those restrictions.

You say big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills and they need this chance all well. Then I challenge all the big gyms to incorporate these beginning level 5 cheerleaders into their normal level 5 teams. You all have been very spoiled to be able to put together teams from a mass cheerleading pool. Let's face it. It's been easy for you. It's time to put your coaching talents to work and take chances on those new level 5 cheerleaders and add them to your normal 5 teams. You might just get a small glimpse what a small gym coach is face with ever single day.

I know that my challenge to Large gyms will never come true and this division will be smashed by the Large gyms just as all the Open divisions this season. But someone needs to start standing up and fighting for what is right! It's time!

CHERZ2U · Member

This is a great stepping stone for many gyms to enter into the L5 division. I just hope they do not allow the teams to be stacked with cross-overs from world bound teams.

-- Edited by CHERZ2U on Thursday 16th of April 2009 08:17:33 AM

cheeeer · Veteran Member

tracy wrote:

CaliCheerWatcher wrote:

tracy wrote:

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

Woah! thats asking a little much, dont you think? I also dont see the problem with biger gyms using it. Big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills but just not quite ready to be on that super competitive level 5 team yet also, not just small gyms. This could be a great place for them. I could see in bigger gyms dropped there current teams into this division that could be a problem, but if its just an addition for those that would have otherwhise stayed on level 4 another year but have fulls. This could be a good think.

I personally believe that my request is not too much to ask. This is the only way that a small gym could have a fighting chance in the BIG, BAD, CHEER WORLD!

It's time to start looking at the bigger picture here and there needs to be restrictions on certain categories and held to those restrictions.

You say big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills and they need this chance all well. Then I challenge all the big gyms to incorporate these beginning level 5 cheerleaders into their normal level 5 teams. You all have been very spoiled to be able to put together teams from a mass cheerleading pool. Let's face it. It's been easy for you. It's time to put your coaching talents to work and take chances on those new level 5 cheerleaders and add them to your normal 5 teams. You might just get a small glimpse what a small gym coach is face with ever single day.

I know that my challenge to Large gyms will never come true and this division will be smashed by the Large gyms just as all the Open divisions this season. But someone needs to start standing up and fighting for what is right! It's time!

Wow! A little harsh on the big gyms don't you think? I'm not sure that every gym started out big so you have to start somewhere and pay your dues. Most of these kids didn't come in having their fulls so when the so called "big gym" incorporated a new level 5 cheerleader into their existing level 5 team, they took their chances and at the same time, the new level 5 cheerleader learned her skills and how to perform like all the others before him or her. It's crazy to me how the people on this board know what's best for the cheer world. Maybe some of you want a new job making cheerleading rules.

Gym Coach · Member

I am so happy that girls will have the chance to compete a single full without having to worry about going right into their double. This level will be a huge asset for the cheer world. Not sure about the coed inclusion though.

tracy · Veteran Member

cheeeer wrote:

tracy wrote:

CaliCheerWatcher wrote:

tracy wrote:

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

Woah! thats asking a little much, dont you think? I also dont see the problem with biger gyms using it. Big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills but just not quite ready to be on that super competitive level 5 team yet also, not just small gyms. This could be a great place for them. I could see in bigger gyms dropped there current teams into this division that could be a problem, but if its just an addition for those that would have otherwhise stayed on level 4 another year but have fulls. This could be a good think.

I personally believe that my request is not too much to ask. This is the only way that a small gym could have a fighting chance in the BIG, BAD, CHEER WORLD!

It's time to start looking at the bigger picture here and there needs to be restrictions on certain categories and held to those restrictions.

You say big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills and they need this chance all well. Then I challenge all the big gyms to incorporate these beginning level 5 cheerleaders into their normal level 5 teams. You all have been very spoiled to be able to put together teams from a mass cheerleading pool. Let's face it. It's been easy for you. It's time to put your coaching talents to work and take chances on those new level 5 cheerleaders and add them to your normal 5 teams. You might just get a small glimpse what a small gym coach is face with ever single day.

I know that my challenge to Large gyms will never come true and this division will be smashed by the Large gyms just as all the Open divisions this season. But someone needs to start standing up and fighting for what is right! It's time!

Wow! A little harsh on the big gyms don't you think? I'm not sure that every gym started out big so you have to start somewhere and pay your dues. Most of these kids didn't come in having their fulls so when the so called "big gym" incorporated a new level 5 cheerleader into their existing level 5 team, they took their chances and at the same time, the new level 5 cheerleader learned her skills and how to perform like all the others before him or her. It's crazy to me how the people on this board know what's best for the cheer world. Maybe some of you want a new job making cheerleading rules.

NOPE! I am not being harsh enough when it comes to the large gyms. Everyone needs to understand the politics of cheerleading. It's the large gyms that are pushing the agendas and the event producers are listening and catering to them left and right.

For example: There are gyms out there with large numbers, huge numbers, anywhere from 200 to 500 kids. These gyms are asked to attend competition for FREE. Yes, for FREE or at huge discounted prices. Why? Because the event producers know that they can eat the registration costs because of the Fan base that follows these large gyms. They - event producers - will make it up in admission prices, apparel sales, concessions, etc. You get the idea. this is just one example of what the event producers do for large gyms and what some large gyms are getting away with and aren't sharing with you.

In addition, it is important for the event producers to keep these gyms happy so that these gyms will return year after year. There are lots of perks being a large gym.

So when you tell me I am being to harsh it's not harsh enough and it's time that we start asking for added restrictions for large gyms and make they work and pay just as much as the small gyms. In addition, it's time that Small Gyms are given what themdeserve as well.

Regulations need to be enforced and if they need added employees to make it happen, then sign me up! It's time to make this sport FAIR and CLEAN!!!

-- Edited by tracy on Thursday 16th of April 2009 09:59:37 AM

-- Edited by tracy on Thursday 16th of April 2009 10:21:56 AM

cheeeer · Veteran Member

tracy wrote:

cheeeer wrote:

tracy wrote:

CaliCheerWatcher wrote:

tracy wrote:

Love this idea IF the division is used how it was intended. This is a senior prep level 5 division. It's just one more step before the actual level 5. HOWEVER, we all know good and well that teams will take advantage of this division just as they all have with every other OPEN division this season. I don't like the co-ed side of this division either.

This division needs to be:

1. ALL-GIRL only
2. Limited to small gyms only - 75 members or less
3. All girls need to have been competing on a level 4 team all last season
4. No crossovers from another level 5 team in the gym

This division will be the most heavily used division next season. GUARANTEED! And that's too back because the intention was a good one.

Woah! thats asking a little much, dont you think? I also dont see the problem with biger gyms using it. Big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills but just not quite ready to be on that super competitive level 5 team yet also, not just small gyms. This could be a great place for them. I could see in bigger gyms dropped there current teams into this division that could be a problem, but if its just an addition for those that would have otherwhise stayed on level 4 another year but have fulls. This could be a good think.

I personally believe that my request is not too much to ask. This is the only way that a small gym could have a fighting chance in the BIG, BAD, CHEER WORLD!

It's time to start looking at the bigger picture here and there needs to be restrictions on certain categories and held to those restrictions.

You say big gyms have cheerleaders that have some level 5 skills and they need this chance all well. Then I challenge all the big gyms to incorporate these beginning level 5 cheerleaders into their normal level 5 teams. You all have been very spoiled to be able to put together teams from a mass cheerleading pool. Let's face it. It's been easy for you. It's time to put your coaching talents to work and take chances on those new level 5 cheerleaders and add them to your normal 5 teams. You might just get a small glimpse what a small gym coach is face with ever single day.

I know that my challenge to Large gyms will never come true and this division will be smashed by the Large gyms just as all the Open divisions this season. But someone needs to start standing up and fighting for what is right! It's time!

Wow! A little harsh on the big gyms don't you think? I'm not sure that every gym started out big so you have to start somewhere and pay your dues. Most of these kids didn't come in having their fulls so when the so called "big gym" incorporated a new level 5 cheerleader into their existing level 5 team, they took their chances and at the same time, the new level 5 cheerleader learned her skills and how to perform like all the others before him or her. It's crazy to me how the people on this board know what's best for the cheer world. Maybe some of you want a new job making cheerleading rules.

NOPE! I am not being harsh enough when it comes to the large gyms. Everyone needs to understand the politics of cheerleading. It's the large gyms that are pushing the agendas and the event producers are listening and catering to them left and right.

For example: There are gyms out there with large numbers, huge numbers, anywhere from 200 to 500 kids. These gyms are asked to attend competition for FREE. Yes, for FREE or at huge discounted prices. Why? Because the event producers know that they can eat the registration costs because of the Fan base that follows these large gyms. They - event producers - will make it up in admission prices, apparel sales, concessions, etc. You get the idea. this is just one example of what the event producers do for large gyms and what some large gyms are getting away with and aren't sharing with you.

In addition, it is important for the event producers to keep these gyms happy so that these gyms will return year after year. There are lots of perks being a large gym.

So when you tell me I am being to harsh it's not hard enough and it's time that we start asking for added restrictions for large gyms and make they work and pay just as much as the small gyms. In addition, it's time that Small Gyms are given what they deserve as well.

Regulations need to be enforced and if they need added employees to make it happen, then sign me up! It's time to make this sport FAIR and CLEAN!!!

-- Edited by tracy on Thursday 16th of April 2009 09:59:37 AM

Wow again. So because you say so, the competition producers are allowing the large gyms (200-500 competitors) compete for free or at a huge discounted price. So, when Cheer Power charges $100 per athlete, they're going to give up $50,000 or more depending on how many large teams are attending, in hopes they can make it up by charging their followers entrance fees. OMG, I find that hard to believe. I wouldn't know, we don't belong to a large gym. Maybe you really have the inside scoop. I hope this isn't how it's all played out because I don't want my cheeeer bubble popped. Nevertheless, remember, every cheer gym did not start out with 200-500 athletes, they work hard and work their way up. Keep a positive attitude; it's contagious smile

Love 2 Fly · Member

Totally agree with you Tracy. The bigger gyms do get preferential treatment. Anyone who disagrees with that is lying or from a big gym. That is part of the reason we are seeing so many mergers. Everyone knows you can make a bigger impact at a competition with 200+ athletes with parents, friends, etc. than with a gym with only a couple of teams. The dynamic is altogether different. And it won't matter what the senior open 5 team was meant to accomplish, it will only be another division the big gyms will dominate.

I don't think anyone is not being positive. Those of us who have been at this a little while just know what to expect. No one is hating or jealous. It is just the way it is. Don't want to pop anyones cheer bubble, but we have to be realistic.

-- Edited by Love 2 Fly on Thursday 16th of April 2009 10:36:09 AM