Tripple Teaming????

Date: Mon Oct 20 12:33 PM, 2008

Tripple Teaming????

Date: Mon Oct 20 12:35 PM, 2008

triple

Date: Mon Oct 20 1:01 PM, 2008

honestly I think that cheerleaders who are on level 5 teams have no business on a level 2 or 3 squad. i agree that sometimes you have to crossover to help with team size but it should only be down a level or up a level. there is a gym in solano county that has been doing that for years. it is really riciculous they have kids on their junior senior and even open age team(college).
some of the kids are even on their youth team too.
we all just shake our heads at how ridiculous they look and feel they are just desperate to try to have more teams than their actual numbers are. we laugh as we watch one squad come off and half their team has to run out back to warm up again.
but i just dont blane the gym, the parents i guess think their child is special vecause they are on 3 or even 4 teams and brag about it like its an honor. we all just know its the whack cheer mom who wants to live through their child and feel important at the gym

Date: Mon Oct 20 1:45 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

honestly I think that cheerleaders who are on level 5 teams have no business on a level 2 or 3 squad. i agree that sometimes you have to crossover to help with team size but it should only be down a level or up a level. there is a gym in solano county that has been doing that for years. it is really riciculous they have kids on their junior senior and even open age team(college).
some of the kids are even on their youth team too.
we all just shake our heads at how ridiculous they look and feel they are just desperate to try to have more teams than their actual numbers are. we laugh as we watch one squad come off and half their team has to run out back to warm up again.
but i just dont blane the gym, the parents i guess think their child is special vecause they are on 3 or even 4 teams and brag about it like its an honor. we all just know its the whack cheer mom who wants to live through their child and feel important at the gym

Until USASF puts out some rule banning it or at least LIMITING IT, gyms will continue to do it because other gyms are, and it's the only way to stay competitive.

Date: Wed Oct 22 7:32 AM, 2008

I am NOT a fan of crossovers. But as somone posted until they make it illegal there is nothing we can do. Which brings me to this point. If everyone is concrened about cheer safety, why isn't this illegal? By allowing crossovers you are putting an individual at risk for injury.

People state they have cross overs to fill in the gap because of the lack of members to complete a team but then there are some that blatenly take advantage of the crossover rule for whatever purpose I don't know. Why would a 200 and over member gym need crossovers (unless for injury purposes).

With that being said, I know people bring up issues about crossing over down levels (ie: 5 to 4 to 3 to 2 to 1). Each level has max skill that can be thrown, if they stict to it what is the issue?

Oh wait.... thats right.... It is more polished........ So what, who cares... how is 1 or 2 going to make that big of a difference in a team of 36. Maybe the individual that you saw on level 5 is not a polished level 5er and could still be a 4er. Regardless, you have a max skill in each level as long as the individual is not throwing a skill outside the level requirement I think the arguement is weak.

Date: Wed Oct 22 7:40 AM, 2008

we do it for stunting more than tumbling reasons. It also motivates the kids to get at that level. I am not sure why its such a big deal. Also the limit should just be 5 per team because that will monitor the amount of kids cross competing.

Date: Wed Oct 22 7:53 AM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

we do it for stunting more than tumbling reasons. It also motivates the kids to get at that level. I am not sure why its such a big deal. Also the limit should just be 5 per team because that will monitor the amount of kids cross competing.

I would drop that number lower but the problem you run into is that people abuse the intent of the rule. I remember being at a National Competition where a team of 36, oh wait no that was the time when there was no maxl, so I would have to put this team at 40 or so, but whatever - I am ranting, the point is a max of maybe 10 girls showed up at awards cause the rest of the team was in warm-ups for other teams they were competing on. Hmmm maybe they should of a had a small team if they had to fill the roster with that many cross overs.

Date: Wed Oct 22 9:42 AM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

we do it for stunting more than tumbling reasons. It also motivates the kids to get at that level. I am not sure why its such a big deal. Also the limit should just be 5 per team because that will monitor the amount of kids cross competing.

I would drop that number lower but the problem you run into is that people abuse the intent of the rule. I remember being at a National Competition where a team of 36, oh wait no that was the time when there was no maxl, so I would have to put this team at 40 or so, but whatever - I am ranting, the point is a max of maybe 10 girls showed up at awards cause the rest of the team was in warm-ups for other teams they were competing on. Hmmm maybe they should of a had a small team if they had to fill the roster with that many cross overs.

Some of my teams only have 10 kids show up for awards not because they are crossing over so much, but because I don't make it i mandatory for the kids to stay all the way to the end, especially the senior teams that have to be there so late on a Sunday night. So don't just assume it's because of crossovers.

Date: Wed Oct 22 11:57 AM, 2008

Sometime its a level 3 student who is croasing up to 5 to base. Is that wrong too. Or is this tread just about jump level 5 tumblers to 2. Its all for fun. Kids that can't tubler still base and those level 5 kids can't base. Its an even trade. The level 2 and 3 kids get something to shoot for see real work eithic. I have to mention the golden rule NOT AGAINST ANY RULES.

Date: Wed Oct 22 12:20 PM, 2008

I can understand if a person is truely on the team. But it drives me crazy when I see kids just tumbling in a routine and then ducking in the back for the rest of the routine. Points should be deducted for overall appeal because this is a distraction and usually you can tell that the tumblers are tumbling below there skill level.

Date: Wed Oct 22 11:07 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

I can understand if a person is truely on the team. But it drives me crazy when I see kids just tumbling in a routine and then ducking in the back for the rest of the routine. Points should be deducted for overall appeal because this is a distraction and usually you can tell that the tumblers are tumbling below there skill level.

America's best used to take away from your score if you would try to hide people like that - don't know if they still do now that Jamfest bought them out.

flipkidjudge · Senior Member

I have posted to this subject of crossovers many times as a coach. Let me respond to this one as a parent who has a child who crosses up, not down.

My 16 year old at tryouts (May 08) had no tumbling. A BHS with a spot only. Her assignment based on her skill level at that time was Level 2. Practice is 4 hours a week plus 2.5 for tumbling, if she chooses to take advantage of it. During the summer her skills progressed as this was the first year she decided to take tumbling seriously. When we opened a new location that had a Senior Coed 3 team she was invited to be on that team as well. This added 2 more hours of practice with another 3.5 optional tumbling should she desire it.

Her tumbling skills progressed to now she is throwing a ROBHS Layout (still needs work as she is not comfortable yet IMHO tumbling out of BHS); Standing BHS series., Standing Tuck and working on jumps to tuck. After the first competition, she was asked to join the Level 4 team so they could put up one more stunt group...not for her tumbling. Now this adds another 2 hours of practice, with no extra optional tumbling time as she is already maxing that out.

So her hours for Cheer practice are 8 hours a week, with an optional 6 hours for tumbling should she decide to take advantage of it. That is solely her choice as I do not force her, one way or the other on the optional times. This is also the first year I have ever allowed her do more than one cheer team. She also dances so that adds 1.5 hours, so her total required time is 9.5 hours out of 168. She still finds time to get homework done, church, socialize, and even occasionally do all her chores...lol.

My amount of hours point of reference is that in every sport I every competed in my required practice was way more than 8 hours a week. Even when I did rec league wrestling and football it was that many hours and that was way back in the 70's.

Now...is it fair to pull her off the level 2 team that she was assigned to at tryouts because her skills have progressed? If she can abandon that team for the higher levels, what message does that send? That you can skip out on those other kids who may be struggling to get their skills? What message does that send to those lower level coaches...that as soon as your kids get skills, you gotta find somebody else because we are snatching them off your team for good? Or do you honor the commitment for that team you agreed to at the beginning of the year and stick it through, knowing that you can bring a level of poise and performance to help that team out?

As a parent I have control of how many teams she is on. If i say enough, then that is it. She has been asked in years past and I always said no. This is the first time I have allowed it. If you don't want your child to double, triple team, then don't let them do it as a parent. If you don't understand why your gym may ask you to do it, talk honestly with the coaches and the owners...just don't be 'flattered" that they asked you You can always say no. And if they try to force you, you can always find someplace else.

-- Edited by flipkidjudge at 06:40, 2008-10-23

Date: Thu Oct 23 6:59 AM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

we do it for stunting more than tumbling reasons. It also motivates the kids to get at that level. I am not sure why its such a big deal. Also the limit should just be 5 per team because that will monitor the amount of kids cross competing.

I would drop that number lower but the problem you run into is that people abuse the intent of the rule. I remember being at a National Competition where a team of 36, oh wait no that was the time when there was no maxl, so I would have to put this team at 40 or so, but whatever - I am ranting, the point is a max of maybe 10 girls showed up at awards cause the rest of the team was in warm-ups for other teams they were competing on. Hmmm maybe they should of a had a small team if they had to fill the roster with that many cross overs.

Some of my teams only have 10 kids show up for awards not because they are crossing over so much, but because I don't make it i mandatory for the kids to stay all the way to the end, especially the senior teams that have to be there so late on a Sunday night. So don't just assume it's because of crossovers.

Don't assume I was talking about your gym. The particular time I encountered I know for fact the reason why their girls weren't at awards. It was stated by even their own members. But that is neither here nor there, my point was if you can't make a complete team with only using a couple crossovers then maybe you shouldn't have that team at all.

Fierce Coach · GURU

I think before you judge any team for their decisions with cross overs you must think that there are other reasons for that girl to be cross competing besides what your head wants to believe. TEAM A could have had a last minute injury, and just to insure that the team's routine will hit, TEAM A pulled down one of their higher level athletes to help out. We've all heard of this. TEAM A places "Shannon" on level 3 even though she is close to her standing tuck/ layout. By the middle of the season she is throwing a layout and tuck, so TEAM A cross competes her up to level 4 to use her skill. We've also all heard of this too. I'm sure there are plenty more reasons for cross competing an athlete that are legit. :) But, along with that statement, there are reasons that aren't legit too. Whether or not that's any of our business, I don't know. But... I don't think we will have to worry for too long. Cross competing will have stronger, more enforced rules about it, within the next five years.

We have done cross competing before, and we decided this season to not cross compete anyone unless injury occurs. It was way too hard last season, and it made all of our routines harder to hit because "Sally" was tired from her level 4 routine.

Triple teaming will eat you alive, if you ask me! I'd sleep like a baby after a competition.

Date: Sat Oct 25 9:00 PM, 2008

I don't think anyone needs to be judging teams for whatever double or triple teaming they do. It's trying to replace athletes at the last minute and pull off a good routine. It is such a hard business to keep up with and I don't judge anyone. It is not my place. Thank God, we have had so many kids come into our program this year, we don't have any double teamers yet. But if an injury, or an athlete quits at the last minute, guess what? we will be double teaming. and it is noones business but ours.

Date: Sun Oct 26 1:01 AM, 2008

I think people understand you have to replace athletes who get hurt. It's the triple teaming for reasons other than injuries some have a problem with. But there must not be anything wrong with doing it since USASF hasn't stepped in with any rules against it. Gyms might as well take advantage of the opportunity, if they have kids willing to learn two or three routines and put in the effort.

Date: Sun Oct 26 10:22 AM, 2008

My #1 concern with tripple teaming is grades. I can't believe that these kids are as productive in the classroom or with homework/studying as they can potentially be. AS Cheer is hard enough on some kids just having to meet the demands of being on one team. Two teams, IMHO, is doable but not by all kids. But THREE teams? That takes a toll on the childs rest, studying, and family life. But I guess as long as the parent is willing to do it then they must have found some way to make it happen and meet the remainder of life's demands. blankstare

Date: Sun Oct 26 2:39 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

My #1 concern with tripple teaming is grades. I can't believe that these kids are as productive in the classroom or with homework/studying as they can potentially be. AS Cheer is hard enough on some kids just having to meet the demands of being on one team. Two teams, IMHO, is doable but not by all kids. But THREE teams? That takes a toll on the childs rest, studying, and family life. But I guess as long as the parent is willing to do it then they must have found some way to make it happen and meet the remainder of life's demands.

Well bottomline is, it is none of your business. Raise your children the way you want to, and run your gym the way you want to. Until the rules change, it is legal. If you are concerned with this, write USASF. Personally I don't care for some of their rules, but I have and will let them know.

Date: Sun Oct 26 4:38 PM, 2008

Wow, took that a little personal! Relax why dontcha? LOL

Date: Sun Oct 26 9:28 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Wow, took that a little personal! Relax why dontcha? LOL

Not me, I have so many kids at my gym I don't need to double, triple or whatever. I just think if they do, it's their business and not mine! Simple!