Spirit Spec results

Date: Tue Feb 5 3:19 PM, 2008

RE: Spirit Spec results

Date: Tue Feb 5 3:44 PM, 2008

Some judges award more for difficulty which in more cases than not would have made up for the deductions. That was not the case here. Just like in football, any given Sunday anyone can win because every judge sees a routine differently. You have to give credit to All Star Elite for a clean routine when they needed one. Congrats to them.

Date: Tue Feb 5 3:52 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

I think the judges have a hard time judging when they have to compare a large level 4 team with over 35 kids and a small senior team with 20 kids. I think the judges factored all of this and came out with the correct dicision. I was told the score before penalties was a tie. Good Job to Both teams. I am truly amazed at how a small organization like All Star Elite can even compete with these huge companies. This is why we all love our sport.

Well at least all those teams were level 4. Probably hard to judge Midget teams subjectively whe nthey are lumped together with no regard to levels? How do you even know what set of rules to follow.

Date: Tue Feb 5 5:57 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Some judges award more for difficulty which in more cases than not would have made up for the deductions. That was not the case here. Just like in football, any given Sunday anyone can win because every judge sees a routine differently. You have to give credit to All Star Elite for a clean routine when they needed one. Congrats to them.

You have to be kidding me here...clean or not, just watched the videos and all star elite is not even in the same league as power, clean routine or not. They only had 3, possibly 4 standing tucks! Power opens with 90% of their squad throwing standing tucks. Their stunting and tumbling skills don't come close to power in my opinion, clean or not...

Date: Tue Feb 5 6:08 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Some judges award more for difficulty which in more cases than not would have made up for the deductions. That was not the case here. Just like in football, any given Sunday anyone can win because every judge sees a routine differently. You have to give credit to All Star Elite for a clean routine when they needed one. Congrats to them.

But even without awarding more points for "difficulty", shouldn't you score better for your team, regardless of size, having 95% of the girls throwing true level 4 skills?? I didn't see more then 4 standing tucks and 8 layouts on all star elite. Their team was very entertaining and clean, but did not have full squad level 4 skills...that sould count for something score-wise, don't you think?? IMO weirdface

mjv2327 · Member

This is a team that last year had 10 of their 20 girls that had never cheered before.They went to usa nationals in Anahiem and won small sr level 4. the addition of 3 or 4 girls this year with no all star cheer experience. I applaud our cheer director and coaches for the ability to take kids that have never cheered before and perform the way they have. We have our eye on the prize (nationals) not a handful of early season local comps. Thank you for the handful of positive comments.

Date: Tue Feb 5 7:03 PM, 2008

Well I think it's super important to pull off a clean routine. So POWER had more standing tucks...that one element is not enough to win with! Stunts were weak and sloppy and the pyramid section seemed rushed and kaotic. Elite was super clean, hit all stunts and amazing energy.

In the elite stunt series POWER dropped two stunt...one went right back up but the other group just seemed to stand there and fidget and maybe even seemed to be arguing about it. they had to go back up and hit that last skill. That day the better team won. Congrats All Star Elite!!!

Date: Tue Feb 5 7:21 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Well I think it's super important to pull off a clean routine. So POWER had more standing tucks...that one element is not enough to win with! Stunts were weak and sloppy and the pyramid section seemed rushed and kaotic. Elite was super clean, hit all stunts and amazing energy.

In the elite stunt series POWER dropped two stunt...one went right back up but the other group just seemed to stand there and fidget and maybe even seemed to be arguing about it. they had to go back up and hit that last skill. That day the better team won. Congrats All Star Elite!!!

I disagree...while I believe being clean is important, I also believe you have to have the majority of your team throwing level appropriate skills. Why even have levels if all you are looking for is a "clean" routine. Why not just have everyone compete together and say who ever is cleanest wins?? It is very easy to be "clean" when you are not throwing difficult tumbling or stunts. I am not saying this in anyway to "bash" all star elite, they were very clean and fun to watch, but not the "better" team IMO. Keep working those skills, your team has tremendous potential, good luck the rest of your season!

Date: Tue Feb 5 7:59 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Well I think it's super important to pull off a clean routine. So POWER had more standing tucks...that one element is not enough to win with! Stunts were weak and sloppy and the pyramid section seemed rushed and kaotic. Elite was super clean, hit all stunts and amazing energy.

In the elite stunt series POWER dropped two stunt...one went right back up but the other group just seemed to stand there and fidget and maybe even seemed to be arguing about it. they had to go back up and hit that last skill. That day the better team won. Congrats All Star Elite!!!

I disagree...while I believe being clean is important, I also believe you have to have the majority of your team throwing level appropriate skills. Why even have levels if all you are looking for is a "clean" routine. Why not just have everyone compete together and say who ever is cleanest wins?? It is very easy to be "clean" when you are not throwing difficult tumbling or stunts. I am not saying this in anyway to "bash" all star elite, they were very clean and fun to watch, but not the "better" team IMO. Keep working those skills, your team has tremendous potential, good luck the rest of your season!

Have to agree, it's easy to be clean when you have a simpler routine, with 20 members but only 4 stunt groups (why not 5)? I agree, they have potential and were clean and fun to watch.

Date: Tue Feb 5 10:03 PM, 2008

According the the Score sheet posted on Cheergyms website difficulty points should be awarded
1-3 pts. Routine did not incorporate the most difficult skills allowed for the level. Only a few team members performed the most difficult skills allowed in level. Simple choreography.
4-7 pts Routine had a mixture of difficult skills allowed for the level. Most of the team performed skills allowed in level.
8-10 pts. Majority of the team did the most difficult skills allowed for the level. Most of the routine was at the upper difficulty range for the level. Adv. Choreography

Date: Tue Feb 5 10:38 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Well I think it's super important to pull off a clean routine. So POWER had more standing tucks...that one element is not enough to win with! Stunts were weak and sloppy and the pyramid section seemed rushed and kaotic. Elite was super clean, hit all stunts and amazing energy.

In the elite stunt series POWER dropped two stunt...one went right back up but the other group just seemed to stand there and fidget and maybe even seemed to be arguing about it. they had to go back up and hit that last skill. That day the better team won. Congrats All Star Elite!!!

I disagree...while I believe being clean is important, I also believe you have to have the majority of your team throwing level appropriate skills. Why even have levels if all you are looking for is a "clean" routine. Why not just have everyone compete together and say who ever is cleanest wins?? It is very easy to be "clean" when you are not throwing difficult tumbling or stunts. I am not saying this in anyway to "bash" all star elite, they were very clean and fun to watch, but not the "better" team IMO. Keep working those skills, your team has tremendous potential, good luck the rest of your season!

Well you seemed to stick on the clean thing when that wasn't the only good element of the Elite performance. I also said all stunts hit and they had tons of energy.

So you rae saying we shouldn't care that power dropped two stunts in one section simply becasue they put more up? That's ridiculous.

Date: Tue Feb 5 10:50 PM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Well I think it's super important to pull off a clean routine. So POWER had more standing tucks...that one element is not enough to win with! Stunts were weak and sloppy and the pyramid section seemed rushed and kaotic. Elite was super clean, hit all stunts and amazing energy.

In the elite stunt series POWER dropped two stunt...one went right back up but the other group just seemed to stand there and fidget and maybe even seemed to be arguing about it. they had to go back up and hit that last skill. That day the better team won. Congrats All Star Elite!!!

I disagree...while I believe being clean is important, I also believe you have to have the majority of your team throwing level appropriate skills. Why even have levels if all you are looking for is a "clean" routine. Why not just have everyone compete together and say who ever is cleanest wins?? It is very easy to be "clean" when you are not throwing difficult tumbling or stunts. I am not saying this in anyway to "bash" all star elite, they were very clean and fun to watch, but not the "better" team IMO. Keep working those skills, your team has tremendous potential, good luck the rest of your season!

Well you seemed to stick on the clean thing when that wasn't the only good element of the Elite performance. I also said all stunts hit and they had tons of energy.

So you rae saying we shouldn't care that power dropped two stunts in one section simply becasue they put more up? That's ridiculous.

Its not about number of stunts, but percentage of girls throwing level appropriate tumbling skills and the difficulty level of the stunts being performed, not how many stunts are being put up, you are missing the point. No one disagrees with you about the 2 dropped stunts, but if you want to argue stunts, look at the timing in all stars individuals and their pyramid...timing is off...and power performed just as "energetically" as any team I have seen.

I am not from either team, but IMO, power is just a stronger level 4 team all around skill wise. Good luck to both teams the rest of the season.

On another point, since so much emphasis is being put on clean routines, I am curious how everyone feels about power large 5 getting grand champs when they had 2 dropped stunts and several bad falls during pass tumbling?

Date: Tue Feb 5 10:50 PM, 2008

This very argument has been going on for years. Which should score more, the simple clean routine or the more difficult routine that takes more chances but is not as clean. Thanks to this message board we can see the two routines for ourselves and compare. Now I saw the exact same routine, just as clean, performed at GSSA by All Star Elite, and there they took 4th out of 5, losing to performances that were not as clean but had more difficulty. Total opposite at this competition. It's all in the eyes of the beholders (judges) and how they choose to score it. And that is why often times we leave these competitions scratching our heads. Clean won at this one, congrats to them!

Date: Tue Feb 5 10:59 PM, 2008

I don't understand how you can get difficulty points for skills that don't hit. If I had 4 fulls, but a 5th try a full and fall flat on her butt, do i get credit for 5 fulls? And if yes, why? The skill didn't hit, so technically you shouldn't even get points for it. Otherwise, why not just attempt everything? Why promote injuries?

Date: Tue Feb 5 11:23 PM, 2008

You would get credit for the 4 fulls, with a deduction for the 5th that failed, right? And that should beat half the amount of clean fulls (2).

Date: Tue Feb 5 11:27 PM, 2008

Nelson wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nelson, a quick question. I'm fairly sure I was able to view these on my mac last year, but this year they are wmv files. Were they different last year and is there any way to view them on a mac?

I don't remember the format last year, if I'm not mistaken I think they were embedded directly onto the site through youtube. Anyways, I googled your question and was directed here:

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/player/wmcomponents.mspx

Try that, see if that works.

Nelson

-- Edited by Nelson at 14:28, 2008-02-05

Thank you Nelson, this worked! It took a while for the wmv files to download, but once they did I was able to open them and view them just fine, thanks!

Date: Wed Feb 6 12:39 AM, 2008

why did that girl on power sit in the front after she tumbled and they have more then 20 people right? for small

cheerwatcher · GURU

My guess would be that they are trying to slowly take her out of the routine before they try and get a bid to worlds (for small) she is already in the large senior routine. I am guessing that that is the same reason why the base for the middle of the pyramid sits down for the dance as well. They looked great John!

John Hebert · Senior Member

Howdy Everyone

1. Senior 4 - Congratulations to All-Star Elite. They were clean and we were not, regardless of skills performed. It was a great learning experience for our members. Hit your stunts, stick your tumbling, perform and leave no questions when you leave the floor, we did not accomplish that this past weekend, but we have used this experience to amp things up for this weekend in Palm Springs. Thank you to those supporters of POWER, but now we must not live in the past, but focus on the future competitions.

2. Small Senior 5 - If you were at the competition you would have heard Nelson announce us as Medium Senior 5. Yes I know there is no such division, but we added two members literally in the warm-up room for a total 22 members (get it...medium senior...a funny, feel free to laugh). Why???

a. There was no competition in our division

b. One of our members had a hairline fracture in her elbow recently and it is not 100%, we wanted her to take it easy and save herself for Palm Springs.

c. One of the additional members filled in for stunts, and one filled in for tumbling. Both went to the front of the floor (kind of like little mascots in youth football) and rooted for the team during the dance section.

d. The show must go on, and we made the most of what we had. I am very proud of the team for a great performance, and thankful for the two members that stepped up at the last minute

3. Hopefully we can start a new thread of competitions to come. We have Palm Springs, Dallas, GSSA, Jamfest LA, and WORLDS.

JOHN

Date: Wed Feb 6 10:02 AM, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Well I think it's super important to pull off a clean routine. So POWER had more standing tucks...that one element is not enough to win with! Stunts were weak and sloppy and the pyramid section seemed rushed and kaotic. Elite was super clean, hit all stunts and amazing energy.

In the elite stunt series POWER dropped two stunt...one went right back up but the other group just seemed to stand there and fidget and maybe even seemed to be arguing about it. they had to go back up and hit that last skill. That day the better team won. Congrats All Star Elite!!!

I disagree...while I believe being clean is important, I also believe you have to have the majority of your team throwing level appropriate skills. Why even have levels if all you are looking for is a "clean" routine. Why not just have everyone compete together and say who ever is cleanest wins?? It is very easy to be "clean" when you are not throwing difficult tumbling or stunts. I am not saying this in anyway to "bash" all star elite, they were very clean and fun to watch, but not the "better" team IMO. Keep working those skills, your team has tremendous potential, good luck the rest of your season!

Have to agree, it's easy to be clean when you have a simpler routine, with 20 members but only 4 stunt groups (why not 5)? I agree, they have potential and were clean and fun to watch.

How ironic, from the same message board that is always complaining that there should be less divisions and to combine this team with that team. Well when you compete with larger teams its based on percentages of team doing the skills. Also large teams can hide things and do larger pyramids which create the apperance of a "bigger and better" routine. I hate seeing small teams go against large for any reason, even to "create competition". It is always HARDER for the small team and this message board proves my point. People are saying Power should win cause they are larger, have mor standing tucks, more skills being thrown, bla bla. Yes they do, but they also have more kids on the floor and able to showcase a bigger picture which gives them competitive advantage. Like it or not, its the truth. I am glad All Star Elite did so well.