I have a son and daughters that cheer. Though my girls gym takes all kids that want to cheer, I asked their coach last year if my son could be on the team, and she said she did not want to take just one boy (I was OK with that, as I always want to find the best place for my kids). So I found another gym for him (where he competed level 2). This year the coach was willing to take my son, and the team is competing level 3.
The problem is that there is often no competition at that level (or just one other team), and the kids (and the parents) don't like not having any competition (and they know that having a boy on the team is the reason why they don't have competition). And honestly, my son is not making the coed team better than any all girl team. I know there are some junior boys that are very good (level 5), but at level 3 and 4 it seems they aren't making a coed team better than an all girl team (so I don't think they need to be in another category). I believe that at level 2 the coed team was allowed to compete against all girl teams.
I'm curious how you all feel. I would really appreciate any comments/feedback from coaches and owners. And if lots of you agree, how do I go about proposing a rule change to the cheer powers that be?
That's a tough one but I don't see the rule changing any time soon. Competition companys need to deal with that situation on a case by case basis. I'd like to see it go to 3 or more males for Jr. Coed. If you have more than 3 Jr. age boys you're likely trying to build your future Coed program. If you have one or two you're usually in a situaton where a couple brothers just walked on.
No matter what I can understand your frustration. It's just too bad that more young boys (or any boys for that matter) weren't more confident and encouraged to participate in our sport. If they were and if they were less concerned with the stigma of being a cheerleader, they would be more likely to pull their friends in solving this whole problem. Make sense?
It's like I always say.....it's one thing to tell your dad you wanna be a cheerleader....it's a whole other thing when you tell him how much it costs!!!
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Danny Kahn Cheergyms.com
"If you're injured don't play. If you play don't tell me you're injured." ~ Don Shula
Danny wrote: It's like I always say.....it's one thing to tell your dad you wanna be a cheerleader....it's a whole other thing when you tell him how much it costs!!!
Haha I've never heard that before! That's a good one.
Unless i'm reading wrong I thought you didn't have to go co-ed if you had a limited amount of boys on the team? What is the minimum to make it a co-ed team?
I know on my daughter's team there are two boys, so we compete coed without much competition so far. However, I don't pay attention to what might be if we didn't have the boys on the team, so I have no idea if there would be other teams even if we went all-girl. I'm just glad to have them on the team, and so is my daughter. It would be nice to compete against others, but not if it means telling someone they can't be on the team.
Onto the actual question, I don't think there should be separate all-girl and coed for juniors at all. In four years of attending all*star competitions, I have yet to see where a boy or many boys make a difference.
I'm not too sure how one would go about requesting that a change is made. I suppose I would start by checking the USASF website, and ask there what steps to take. But I don't think we'll see a change for years, not saying anything against USASF, just big changes usually take a while.
Two years ago I was on Legacy's Junior Coed LV5 team. We had one boy, my little brother. We didn't compete against many teams, usually only 1 or 2. At USA nationals we competed against West Coast Maveriks and their boys definetly made a difference!! Only two of them were really good tumblers, but what set them apart was their partner stunting!! They were partner stunting like a senior coed team, it was really cool to see that skill from a junior team. I agree, usually it does not make a difference in the junior division, but there are a few exceptions.
Being the boy on that junior team i can definitly say that most of the time it doesn't make a difference! But, other times i does EXTREMELY, I do however know that some comoitition companies do look at 1 boy as still All Girl.
I agree that perhaps junior teams shouldnt make a difference between co-ed and all girl, unless they have more than 3 or 4. I definitly think that 1 boy shouldnt make a difference and that they should still be allowed to compete all girl. Sorry, but I dont forsee 1 boy making that big of a difference.
I too think if you have only one boy on your team, you should be able to compete all girl. At least on all girl teams the playing field is more level with the size and level divisons. There is a huge difference between 1 guy versus even three guys. I hope that someone comes up with a solution for this issue. I too think it is rough on programs with one or two guys.
I agree with you Worlds Watcher. We have had a challanging time finding our Small Junior 4 competition this year. There is not one team other than Folsom that is Junior Level 4 in Northern Cali. We are actually small junior 4 and they are Large Junior 4 but I asked the competition company to combine us so we would not be alone in a division.
So now I have the issue of what to do if I know in advance that there arent any other teams in our division. Do we move up to small junior 5, a division we are not really ready for, or do we bump down and get accused of sandbagging the division. Either way I just want my cheerleaders to compete and their families to get what they paid for, competitive cheerleading.
I think you did a great thing by asking the company to combine large and small. If only some of the other teams would do this we would at least see the following competition this weekend:
Junior 3
Cal Storm
Unlimited
Junior Coed 3
Motions
Riptide
Junior 4
Airborne
Folsom
Junior Coed 4
Norcal
But, wouldn't it be nice if at Junior level coed was considered 4+ guys. How many of the 3 coed teams have 4+ guys? So what we might see is even more competition:
Junior 3
Cal Storm
Unlimited
Motions
Riptide
Junior 4
Airborne
Folsom
Norcal
__________________
"Brothers, if you have a message of encouragement for the people, please speak."
Acts 13:14-16
From what I understand Nor Cal only has one boy on Small Junior Coed 4....I would love to compete against them....the more the merrier. Having more teams in the division pushes the kids to push themselves. I welcome the challange, especially since Nor Cal's team is very strong in that division. Goodluck to everyone this weekend.
Our Pyramids Junior Black CoEd is level 4/5 (with one boy). We are not having much luck finding competion. We are attending Cheersport Nationals/Atlanta and we looked up all of Cheersports regional competitions (nationwide) and could only find 3 or 4 teams in our division. I think they should change the CoEd rules if there is 1-4 boys on a team and let them compete against all-girl teams.
I don't believe that you have to attend a cheersport event to go to nationals so dont think you wont have competition at cheersport. If you look at the results from last year at Cheersport there were 8 teams in that division. Below are the teams that were there....some great teams might I add. Hopefully you will have many great teams to compete against!
The Stingray Allstars 262 267.5 529.5 Cheer Dynasty 236 247 483 Pro Cheer Inc. 232 245.5 477.5 Virginia WILD Cougars 217 232 449 Central Mississippi Cheerleading 211.5 228 439.5 Galaxy Cheer 212 205 417 Florida Legacy Diamonds 193 208.5 401.5 The Noble Knights 189 196.5 385.5
If you want to check out competition I would go to Jamfest events back east and south. They seem to have lots of attendance and could give you a better idea of what teams you might see at Cheersport.
__________________
"Brothers, if you have a message of encouragement for the people, please speak."
Acts 13:14-16
I agree with you worlds watcher...we are considering going to Jamfest in Indy next year but its hard to decide between Indy and Vegas, Vegas is closer and a fun location but Indy seems to have such good divisions and its freezing!
I hope that we get to take one of our teams to JamFest in Indiana...it is such a huge competition, and with JamFest being such a great company, it can only be a great experience.
I agree Marlon, we just have to talk these Cali girls into being freezing in the middle of a midwest winter...its my homestate so I am all for it. Look out Indy here comes the Californians.
i can definitly say that most of the time it doesn't make a difference! But, other times i does EXTREMELY, I do however know that some comoitition companies do look at 1 boy as still All Girl.
Big Daddy K
