Junior Division at Worlds 2010

cheerperfectionist · Veteran Member

Junior Division at Worlds 2010

cheerperfectionist · Veteran Member

I also think the Senior Division should be Freshman-Seniors in High School, and the Junior Division should be Middle School, and Youth be Elementary School. It makes it more fair and something to look forward to as you not only move to a different grade/school but to a more advanced team.

p.o.k. · Veteran Member

That would make it very difficult to round out teams, especially for new and small gyms. In addition you would have to think of the skill level of the individual athlete and what a gym can offer for every parent's hard earned cheer dollar. I am sure there are some geographies that do not have a gym on every corner. Thus making it very difficult for an athlete to make a move to accomodate their individual skills and needs.

Advancement is not solely based on age. So would you expect a 9 year old with a full to stay on a Youth 2 because the gym does not have enough athletes to field a Youth 5? Or would you hope a Junior 5 would be available for that individual since the age limit goes up to 14. Whether or not a Junior team goes to World's may be a different issue. Isn't there a significant limit on the number of teams that goes to finals for Junior teams? Making it a very expensive proposition for a team that does not make it to finals.

Magic Coach · Veteran Member

My vote would be no Junior division at Worlds. I think you are right that our sport gives the ultimate prize to early. We eliminate the need to persevere and
"pay our dues"
I also feel the same way about rewarding "National Championships" to every level and age bracket on almost every weekend of the cheer season!!! There has to be some criteria (i.e. a certain # of different states represented to qualify to be a "National") Most gyms that claim multiple "national championships" have never competed out side of their city let alone their state.....
WHATS WRONG WITH CALLING THEM "classics, or regional championships, or open championships ???!!!
We need to bring back to our sport the realities of life. You cannot always win, however, learning to deal with disappointment and adversity with out giving up and without making excuses is a great life lesson that we are not providing to the participants of this sport. JMO

P.S.
I think Seniors is great 12yrs old to 18 yrs old.

partyylikearockstar · Member

I agree Magic Coach. The idea of having all these "National Championships" is wrong. It does not make them special. You can say We won Nationals 3 times... Well how is that special? Saying you won Worlds is special... They're should be 1 National Championship per state, and then Worlds. For example they shouldn't call it "Jamfest Nationals" because they already have one it's in Indienapolis. (I know i spelled that wrong) so how is one small competition in Long Beach a Nationals? It should be called "Jamfest Championship" Also, If they are going to have a Junior Division at Worlds it should be fair across the board. Having only 3 US teams make it to finals is wrong, and the same 3 teams for example (Starlites, Super Cells, Celebrity... Etc..) Will be the ones who make it through, and that was obvious last year when they beat every team and we're undefeated most of the season it doesn't give those others who may not have that many double fulls, or talent a chance. My vote is no Juniors at Worlds also

partyylikearockstar · Member

p.o.k. wrote:

That would make it very difficult to round out teams, especially for new and small gyms. In addition you would have to think of the skill level of the individual athlete and what a gym can offer for every parent's hard earned cheer dollar. I am sure there are some geographies that do not have a gym on every corner. Thus making it very difficult for an athlete to make a move to accomodate their individual skills and needs.

Advancement is not solely based on age. So would you expect a 9 year old with a full to stay on a Youth 2 because the gym does not have enough athletes to field a Youth 5? Or would you hope a Junior 5 would be available for that individual since the age limit goes up to 14. Whether or not a Junior team goes to World's may be a different issue. Isn't there a significant limit on the number of teams that goes to finals for Junior teams? Making it a very expensive proposition for a team that does not make it to finals.

I see where your coming from but, if a 9 year old has a full, and there is no Youth 5 or Junior 5 then they would have to be on a lower level team if they chose to stay at that gym. 9 year olds can not make a senior team anyway and the parent of that child would have to make a choice on whether he/she wants to drive far so that their son or daughter can be on a level 5 team otherwise that 9 year old is unfortunetly out of luck. Yes, only 3 US teams make finals... and about 50 in the division so those parents are paying a lot for their child to go to Worlds to compete for one day...

08er · Member

I agree with not having Junior Levels at Worlds. Give them something to progress to.

One National Championship per state? Isn't that a State Championship? Magiccoach is right about National Championship being over used. Unfortunately it looks good in the papers and club flyers. The only way to control this is thru USASF dictating to it members... which they may now be able to do.

oc popcorn · Veteran Member

I agree that it is something to look forward to as the girls become older, but some junior teams are really great.

Jr5MOM · Newbie

I disagree about having Jr's at worlds, I am a PROUD mom of a Jr 5 cheerleader and she has every right to be at worlds as anyone else at that level. she has her double full and has had it for 2 years and she has her standing full as well. she works just as hard if not harder than some of the girls that go to worlds that don't even deserve to be there (not true level 5 girls) so your going to say that she should not go to worlds because of her age? That doesn't seem fair when she puts her heart and soul into every routine that she puts on the floor. It's bad enough that she can not be on a Sr team because of her age but to take away the chance to go to "worlds" doesn't seem fair! JMO

-- Edited by Jr5MOM on Tuesday 21st of April 2009 05:50:45 PM

-- Edited by Jr5MOM on Tuesday 21st of April 2009 05:54:12 PM

oc popcorn · Veteran Member

I agree.

ACEDAD · GURU

Jr5MOM wrote:

I disagree about having Jr's at worlds, I am a PROUD mom of a Jr 5 cheerleader and she has every right to be at worlds as anyone else at that level. she has her double full and has had it for 2 years and she has her standing full as well. she works just as hard if not harder than some of the girls that go to worlds that don't even deserve to be there (not true level 5 girls) so your going to say that she should not go to worlds because of her age? That doesn't seem fair when she puts her heart and soul into every routine that she puts on the floor. It's bad enough that she can not be on a Sr team because of her age but to take away the chance to go to "worlds" doesn't seem fair! JMO

I don't think Juniors should be allowed at Worlds. They've only been attending for a couple of years anyway, so I don't think it will be a real dream killer for all the juniors in the US.

I have no doubt that you are proud of your daughter and you have every reason to be. I have no doubt that she works just as hard or harder than some of the girls that attend.

But, frankly, none of your arguments hold up. Others are locked out because of their age. What about the Youth teams? Many of them are just as talented and work just as hard as some of the junior teams. Is it fair that they can't go? Well, yes. Because some things should be restricted and, in my opinion, Worlds should be restricted to the Senior and International teams. Obviously a number of people disagree with me because the juniors are currently attending.

However, I will continue to lobby to cut out the junior teams. Some things people should just have to wait for and I think Worlds is one of them.

cheerstoya · Senior Member

Jr5MOM wrote:

I disagree about having Jr's at worlds, I am a PROUD mom of a Jr 5 cheerleader and she has every right to be at worlds as anyone else at that level. she has her double full and has had it for 2 years and she has her standing full as well. she works just as hard if not harder than some of the girls that go to worlds that don't even deserve to be there (not true level 5 girls) so your going to say that she should not go to worlds because of her age? That doesn't seem fair when she puts her heart and soul into every routine that she puts on the floor. It's bad enough that she can not be on a Sr team because of her age but to take away the chance to go to "worlds" doesn't seem fair! JMO

-- Edited by Jr5MOM on Tuesday 21st of April 2009 05:50:45 PM

-- Edited by Jr5MOM on Tuesday 21st of April 2009 05:54:12 PM

I agree with you. I understand youth teams, but not jr teams.

cheerperfectionist · Veteran Member

ACEDAD wrote:

Jr5MOM wrote:

I disagree about having Jr's at worlds, I am a PROUD mom of a Jr 5 cheerleader and she has every right to be at worlds as anyone else at that level. she has her double full and has had it for 2 years and she has her standing full as well. she works just as hard if not harder than some of the girls that go to worlds that don't even deserve to be there (not true level 5 girls) so your going to say that she should not go to worlds because of her age? That doesn't seem fair when she puts her heart and soul into every routine that she puts on the floor. It's bad enough that she can not be on a Sr team because of her age but to take away the chance to go to "worlds" doesn't seem fair! JMO
I don't think Juniors should be allowed at Worlds. They've only been attending for a couple of years anyway, so I don't think it will be a real dream killer for all the juniors in the US.

I have no doubt that you are proud of your daughter and you have every reason to be. I have no doubt that she works just as hard or harder than some of the girls that attend.

But, frankly, none of your arguments hold up. Others are locked out because of their age. What about the Youth teams? Many of them are just as talented and work just as hard as some of the junior teams. Is it fair that they can't go? Well, yes. Because some things should be restricted and, in my opinion, Worlds should be restricted to the Senior and International teams. Obviously a number of people disagree with me because the juniors are currently attending.
However, I will continue to lobby to cut out the junior teams. Some things people should just have to wait for and I think Worlds is one of them.

Haha i was going to say the same thing, some of her arguements don't hold up. Worlds has always been Senior and International Divisions, except for the last few years and It should stay that way, it gives your child something to look forward to, plus most level 5 teams compete out of state anyway so your still getting the experience of competiting against the best just not aloud to attend Worlds yet..

GAVEITALLUP4CHEER · Veteran Member

I am backing ya JR 5 MOM!!! These people may think it's okay for these kids to wait, but I don't, I think as long as local comps all call themselves nationals and they have no comps with integrity to compete at, the kids that are losing a year or two by this increase in the age limit will back off of cheer and join other sports. When they are no longer challanged you lose intrest and we all know this happens very easily with cheer. Then when gyms need to fill the senior teams they won't have any kids with talent because they got tired of waiting around and bounced!! and this may hurt some feelings but my kid could whoop on a senior cheerleader, she could out jump, dance and base ( like I have seen with so many senior teams, her flyer HAS NEVER HIT THE GROUND! so on that note ROCK OUT JR COEDS, SENIORS ARE JUST SCARED YOU WILL TAKE THIER SPOT biggrin

ACEDAD · GURU

GAVEITALLUP4CHEER wrote:

I am backing ya JR 5 MOM!!! These people may think it's okay for these kids to wait, but I don't, I think as long as local comps all call themselves nationals and they have no comps with integrity to compete at, the kids that are losing a year or two by this increase in the age limit will back off of cheer and join other sports. When they are no longer challanged you lose intrest and we all know this happens very easily with cheer. Then when gyms need to fill the senior teams they won't have any kids with talent because they got tired of waiting around and bounced!! and this may hurt some feelings but my kid could whoop on a senior cheerleader, she could out jump, dance and base ( like I have seen with so many senior teams, her flyer HAS NEVER HIT THE GROUND! so on that note ROCK OUT JR COEDS, SENIORS ARE JUST SCARED YOU WILL TAKE THIER SPOT

Don't think for a minute that I don't believe the junior aged kids are talented enough. Many of the kids are absolutely off the chain.

But (for supporters of juniors at Worlds) answer me this: Why shouldn't we include Youth teams as well?

cheerstoya · Senior Member

GAVEITALLUP4CHEER wrote:

I am backing ya JR 5 MOM!!! These people may think it's okay for these kids to wait, but I don't, I think as long as local comps all call themselves nationals and they have no comps with integrity to compete at, the kids that are losing a year or two by this increase in the age limit will back off of cheer and join other sports. When they are no longer challanged you lose intrest and we all know this happens very easily with cheer. Then when gyms need to fill the senior teams they won't have any kids with talent because they got tired of waiting around and bounced!! and this may hurt some feelings but my kid could whoop on a senior cheerleader, she could out jump, dance and base ( like I have seen with so many senior teams, her flyer HAS NEVER HIT THE GROUND! so on that note ROCK OUT JR COEDS, SENIORS ARE JUST SCARED YOU WILL TAKE THIER SPOT

Oh, and as a gym owner the junior kids have the greatest attitude when it comes to competition. Our jr athletes and their parents are planning on world's this next year and I think it is only fair that they be able to go.

ACEDAD · GURU

cheerstoya wrote:

I think it is only fair that they be able to go.

Why?

Jr5MOM · Newbie

The level should determine if the kids should go to worlds not their age, that's why it's called the best of the best "worlds" based on skills not age, what does age have to do with anything anyways? The Jr kids are anticipating and waiting on somthing, being on a Sr team. Skill should determine if the kids should go to worlds not their age. To throw the hardest skills at age 10 and not be able to go to "worlds" because of their age? Come on!

-- Edited by Jr5MOM on Wednesday 22nd of April 2009 08:05:09 PM

ACEDAD · GURU

Jr5MOM wrote:

The level should determine if the kids should go to worlds not their age, that's why it's called the best of the best "worlds" based on skills not age, what does age have to do with anything anyways? The Jr kids are anticipating and waiting on somthing, being on a Sr team. Skill should determine if the kids should go to worlds not their age. To throw the hardest skills at age 10 and not be able to fo to "worlds" because of their age? Come on!

Ok, I'll ask you: should the Youth 5 teams be able to attend Worlds? If so, why?

Nelson · Senior Member

ACEDAD wrote:

Jr5MOM wrote:

The level should determine if the kids should go to worlds not their age, that's why it's called the best of the best "worlds" based on skills not age, what does age have to do with anything anyways? The Jr kids are anticipating and waiting on somthing, being on a Sr team. Skill should determine if the kids should go to worlds not their age. To throw the hardest skills at age 10 and not be able to fo to "worlds" because of their age? Come on!

Ok, I'll ask you: should the Youth 5 teams be able to attend Worlds? If so, why?

Yes, Youth 5 teams should go to Worlds. So should Mini 5 teams. And Tiny 5 teams. And Parent teams. And Senior 2 teams. And Youth 3 teams. And Junior 1 teams.

We should open it to everyone. It's only fair.

And everyone should be able to get a bid. A paid bid.

And everyone should get a globe trophy. And a ring. And perform twice.

And I nominate that Eric Little does everyone's dances. Everyone's.