SOS..February 3-4 2007

SK3 · Veteran Member

SOS..February 3-4 2007

Worlds Watcher · GURU

Is this the competition where you have to compete a bunch of times? I know there is one company out there that does a very different format and I'm thinking it is this one.

Pink Lady · Veteran Member

Worlds Watcher wrote:

Is this the competition where you have to compete a bunch of times? I know there is one company out there that does a very different format and I'm thinking it is this one.

yeah, at least twice tomorrow. Once without music! Depending on how you do, you may have to compete on Sunday too. I think that's how it goes.

SK3 · Veteran Member

Worlds Watcher wrote:

Is this the competition where you have to compete a bunch of times? I know there is one company out there that does a very different format and I'm thinking it is this one.

Yes!! Thats the only thing i dont like about this competition. First each team will do 60 sec. of their routine to counts..then they seed you first to last place based on the 60 sec. After that you perform your whole routine..if you are in first place you only have to perform once..if you are 2nd or up u have to perform twice that day..sunday all teams perform once...crazy huh!

Tamara · cheergyms.com Master Poster

SK3 wrote:

Yes!! Thats the only thing i dont like about this competition. First each team will do 60 sec. of their routine to counts..then they seed you first to last place based on the 60 sec. After that you perform your whole routine..if you are in first place you only have to perform once..if you are 2nd or up u have to perform twice that day..sunday all teams perform once...crazy huh!

That is very different. Have you been to this competition before? When the team performs the 60 sec count part, is the count out loud or is everything just quiet? How do you like this format compared to the others?

SK3 · Veteran Member

Tamara wrote:

SK3 wrote:

Yes!! Thats the only thing i dont like about this competition. First each team will do 60 sec. of their routine to counts..then they seed you first to last place based on the 60 sec. After that you perform your whole routine..if you are in first place you only have to perform once..if you are 2nd or up u have to perform twice that day..sunday all teams perform once...crazy huh!

That is very different. Have you been to this competition before? When the team performs the 60 sec count part, is the count out loud or is everything just quiet? How do you like this format compared to the others?

Yes..this will be my second time going, we went last year too. The coaches count the 60 sec, usually there are coaches in front and coaches in back. The time starts as soon as you step foot on the floor. I think the format is ok, its actually not the bad. The good thing is after the seeding if you are in first you only have to perform once, if your not in first you have to perform twice that day. It could be very tiring, but other than that it is a very nice competition

OC Mom · GURU

My opinion on this one....

I HATED IT....

Em competed but they didn't get first. They had to compete again which was fine. But then, they didn't compete for the finals for 4 1/2 hours after the first time!!!! 90% of our team were sleeping, falling asleep, laying across chairs, laying on the floor, talking on their cell phones, etc....

It was WAY too long in between. They were all worked up to go on the first 2 times, then had to sit for so long that they got tired. By the time they had to compete for the last time, they were DEAD. It was awful.

We aren't going back. It wasn't worth it.

Ok, I'm done now.

cheerwatcher · GURU

WOW .. thats quite different. It would be interesting to see .. Well good luck guys!

LVNDPNKNBLK · Member

Ok, here's one for the experts. I'm hoping someone can help us here. We went to the SOS competition. Went through the 60 second count. We had a bobble and were seeded 3rd out of 5 teams, which was okay because again this was not the final standing, it was only the seeding. So, what happens next is the 1st place team competes against the 5th place team - not fair in my eyes, but its their rule so we compete by it, right? Okay, so then seeds 2, 3, and 4 compete to determine who wins that bracket because the winner will compete against the 1st seeded team for the championship. The two teams left in that bracket will compete for 3rd and 4th places. So here's what happened. Although we were seeded 3rd, competed against seeds 2 and 4, and went on to "win" that bracket, our score it turns out was higher than the score of the #1 seeded team. Well, that is, until the judges called our coach and the #1 seeded team's coach to a corner for a caucus about "mistakes" with the scoring. IF I have my facts right both coaches were told that our team had not, in fact, scored highest but that (after some additional deductions) we were actually TIED with that teams' scores. So one might think, "no problem!" Just let the two teams who are #1 and #2 (them and us respectively) compete, as planned, for the championship. However, that is not what happened. What we were told was that there is a rule that says that in the event of a tie the team seeded lowest of the tied teams (us) shall return to the original seeding position and settle the tie by competing again against the next highest seeded team (i.e. seed #2 who are now a 3rd and unrelated party in all of this since we'd already won against this team). The winner of the "rematch" between seeds 2 and 3 will then advance to compete for the championship, which could either put us back in the same position we are in now, competing with seed #1 for the championship or it could put us in position to place
3rd!(not sure about than one but if we were to lose to seed #2 in the rematch then where else do we go but to 3rd, right? - or do we compete for that too?) I know! This SO confusing! Imagine how it feels to live it. GEESH!

Someone please help me to understand this! How can it be that tieing for first place now places us in a position to potentially compete for third ? If this is truly the rule then I will respect that. I honestly will, with no questions asked. But I have looked into USASF and SOS rules and can find nothing about this. Is a tie breaking rule ever decided by the rule officiator (not sure if that's the proper title)? If anyone can direct me to a helpful website I'd really appreicate it. Have any of you ever experienced this before? The comp is not over and our girls will do their best tomorrow, no matter what. We had some great competition come out this weekend so I'm actually enjoying the show. But today's chain of events have been disturbing to our team parents and gym owners alike. I'd like to get a really good night's sleep tonight. I'd get there faster if I had a little help in this area. Thanks cheerladies and cheergentlemen for helping me to understand the cheer world a little bit better today than yesterday.

Whew! Now that I've said all of that, did anyone have anything wonderful happen to them this weekend? Win any competitions or see any new and surprising routines? Please let me know. I could use some good news tonight!

ACM · Veteran Member

I don't think you are confused about the ruling...as you seemed to be able to fully explain exactly what happened. I'm sure the judges wouldn't have called your coaches and the #1 seeded coach to explain the situation if that wasn't the rule. What you are looking for is a full disclosure of the rules, which is something I'm sure your coaches have probably already asked for.

I went to the SOS website. As for 1st going against the last place team, they are creating bracket style competition that very typical for most athletic competitions. Softball tournaments do this, college basketball does the same exact thing with March madness and college football wishes that they had it as they say it's a more fair way of determining the true champion (those BCS rating can come up with some random results).

I hope you got a good nights sleep. Good luck to your teams and give us an update on the final results.

~ACM (AnotherCheerMom)

Diva Coach Melissa · Senior Member

I am wondering if you were really tied with the #2 team and not the #1. If you are tied with the #1 team, it wouldn't make sense, as there is a final to address the true winner anyway - if your team won their bracket, they should have been competing against the #1 seed for the final anyway. It makes more sense that your team tied with the #2 team, and thus they want a "rematch" to determine who will go on to that final. The whole thing makes much more sense that way - your team was initially told they won, but after assessing the scores it turns out there was a mistake, the #2 and #3 teams were tied, and need to rematch to see who goes to the final.

The issue you are having is with SOS format rules, nothing to do with USASF. So the question you need to ask (to SOS) is what specifically are the rules for this type of "tie" situation, and where are those posted so they can be understood well in advance instead of on-the-fly.

Let us know how it turns out, I'm betting that's what really happened but it sounds confusing!

LVNDPNKNBLK · Member

Thanks so much ACM!  I guess since our team(s) had never been in a tie before this was all very confusing to me. Yes, you're right - our coaches/owners were also seeking full disclosure on this rule and they came up with nothing while still at the comp (I don't know about that night after going home). After finding nothing on the SOS website I thought I'd check with all of you hoping that one of you might possibly have experienced this before and could shed some light. Our gym owners and coaches were doing what they do - You know, prepping all the teams for the next day and just trying to get ready for what the day would bring, whether our people agreed with the tie rule or not.  The show still goes on, right? I could tell our coaches were all tired and needed a little space to exhale. At the time that I asked the question (after a crazy long day) their weary state was obvious so I thought I'd look into it myself.

Diva Coach Melissa, thank you as well. I know this all sounds crazy so if I find that it's all one big miscommunication I will absoutely let you know. Our team, after combining the score from the 60 second count Sat. morning with the score from the actual performance that afternoon, tied with the #1 seeded team, not the #2 seeded team (crazy but as of now, no mistake). The way you explain it (a tie with #2) would have made all the sense in the world to me.  Unfortunately, that's not what SOS was saying, thus the creation of all my confusion.  I will try contacting SOS regarding full disclosure and share what I find with everyone. Wish me luck!

Now, Dun Dun Dun...
The comp is over and all went very well! Our Fierce Ladies (Sr. Level 3) are National Champions! (HOORAY!) and it was a rough road with all the 60 second count, 3rd seed, tie, return to seeding, and championship bracket 6 hours later stuff going on - but appreciated oh so much more!  Our girls were tired but they pulled it off. I have to say that the teams today - Spirit Atheletics, UG2B Cheer, PC Cheer, Magic All Stars, So. Cal Elite and so many more - were PHENOMAL! WOW! I mean that - WOW! Were these teams ever awesome! What a weekend! What an accomplishment for those girls! Woo hoo! But now that its all over with I will definitely get a good night's sleep. Thank you all! I have pass out now. LOL

cheerwatcher · GURU

Awwwwwwww, Im glad it all worked out great! I have to admit, the ladies (sr.3) have been one of my favorite level 3 teams I've seen so far. I'm a huge fan =) Congrats!

LVNDPNKNBLK · Member

cheerwatcher wrote:

Awwwwwwww, Im glad it all worked out great! I have to admit, the ladies (sr.3) have been one of my favorite level 3 teams I've seen so far. I'm a huge fan =) Congrats!

Thank you Cheerwatcher! That means the world to me!

-- Edited by LVNDPNKNBLK at 19:37, 2007-02-04

Pink Lady · Veteran Member

Ok, so let me put in my 2 cents on this competition.........

HATED IT!!!!! 2 THUMBS DOWN!

Let me start off by saying, that 60 second count with no music section is the worst. It is sooooo boring! I had to sit there in silence for 3 hours. Not to mention the room was so dark our glow sticks lit up. The seating was bad and just UUGGGH!

There was too much time inbetween rounds and for kids that have to perform, that sucks the energy out of them.

I had never been to this competition and hopefully I will never go again.  I just did not like it. Even though the routine is just 2 1/2 minutes.  We were there from 6am to 6pm, both days. OMG! The kids performed twice both days, which would not have been bad if there wasn't 4-8 hours inbetween performances. I don't think all of our teams were treated fairly but I guess that's how the ball bounces sometimes.

Anyway, I'm glad it's over and we are moving on. I hope everyone else had a good experience at their competitions!

SK3 · Veteran Member

Yes i second that!!I hated that competition and hope we dont go back next year. I got to see some really great performances but it was just a very long weekend and alot of scoring mistakes were made. If the scores werent going to add up then they shouldnt gave the coaches a breakdown of every teams scores in your division. Just my opinion, congratulations to all the teams that got first place!!

California · Senior Member

Can anybody post the results ?

CoachTal · Veteran Member

This comp was interesting & exhausting... the scores just made no sense whatsoever...but it was fun!

and i dont even remember the results besides senior level 3, 4 & 5.. haha

senior 3
1- fierce ladies
2- spirit athletics
3- u got to believe
4- gators
5- cyclones

senior 4
1- so cal
2- pc
3- fierce

senior 5
1- magic
2- fierce

OC Mom · GURU

magic beat fierce?

CoachTal · Veteran Member

Yes yes.. indeed they did, magic was very consistent both days
Fierce was ahead in the seeding,
Then fierce had tumbling touch downs everywhere the first performance day which lost them.
On sundays performance, Fierce scored 10 points higher than magic, but theyre accumulative score was still lower due to their poor performance on saturday!

Magic was very clean and constistant & deserved it! Good job to you girls!